tdawg87

Dammit Florida

773 posts in this topic

16 minutes ago, Angels N Skins said:

What's sad is our elected officials are Ok with it. As long as it falls in with the party's values.

I think it goes beyond being "Ok" with it. Call me crazy but I think they're actively seeking opportunities to do it. 

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2 hours ago, Adam said:

He looks like Eddie Murphy playing a white guy in a movie.

 

Back when people used to hire Eddie Murphy to make movies. 

 

 

 

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11 hours ago, Thomas said:

How else would you refer to items called no-fly lists and FBI watch lists? Honestly, I'm at a loss as to what else to call them. And yeah, not letting someone fly because of suspicions so we can fool ourselves into sleeping better at night is pretty fucked up too.

I think you know that you were minimizing the ramification of individuals being placed on the terror watch and no-fly list by saying that the audacity of someone being placed on a list doesn't mean anything. I'm not arguing that alone presumes guilt.  But keep in mind that the Orlando killer was placed on the watch list a couple times. Turns out he was rightfully suspected as a potential danger. Anyway, getting past that and putting terminology aside, you seem to be in favor of not having either list to begin with. Would you like to see the government do away with them altogether?

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12 hours ago, Angels N Skins said:

It's a constitutional right so yeah, it's a little important. You should think it is too.

I think I've made clear in that post and the others that there should be a fair process in place. I just don't think it should be rushed, essentially rendering the whole process ineffective.

I think you said last week that people on the no-fly and terror watch list shouldn't have easy access to guns. After listening to your news sources, you now want Congress to drop this issue? Guess this shows how polarizing the media can be.

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35 minutes ago, InsideThePark said:

I think I've made clear in that post and the others that there should be a fair process in place. I just don't think it should be rushed, essentially rendering the whole process ineffective.

I think you said last week that people on the no-fly and terror watch list shouldn't have easy access to guns. After listening to your new sources, you now want Congress to drop this issue? Guess this shows how polarizing the media can be.

For the record, I consider "free" and "fair" to be the most vile 4 letter F words in our language but, that said, I don't know how you plan to reconcile fairness with no time limits or deadlines. 3 days may seem arbitrary but in an age when I can have a pizza at my door in 28 minutes without leaving my sofa I don't see a dire need to give them much more time to come up with probable cause.

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Understood.

Btw I agree that there should be a time limit. Hopefully Congress drops just enough of the partisan nonsense to come up with a reasonable solution. In this climate, that's probably asking too much.

As I just finished typing that, I see that the House has adjourned and won't return until July 5th. It's no wonder that Congress has such a high approval rating, they can't agree on anything.

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McCain got shot down.

A majority of the Senate backed the proposal in a 58 to 38 vote, but it needed 60 votes to advance.

The measure inspired a fierce backlash from privacy advocates, and may have faced resistance in the House, where lawmakers passed a bill earlier this year to limit the government’s authority to access email.

Still, 11 Democrats and one independent senator who affiliates with them voted for the McCain and Burr proposal, while only six Republicans peeled away from their party to oppose the measure.

Earlier this year, FBI Director James Comey said that giving the government the ability to collect information about electronic communications — such as a person’s email account, how much time a person spends on various websites, and their Internet protocol address — without obtaining a court order was the bureau’s top priority.

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/powerpost/wp/2016/06/22/after-orlando-senate-bill-seeks-to-allow-fbi-web-searches-without-court-order/

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43 minutes ago, arch stanton said:

McCain got shot down.

A majority of the Senate backed the proposal in a 58 to 38 vote, but it needed 60 votes to advance.

The measure inspired a fierce backlash from privacy advocates, and may have faced resistance in the House, where lawmakers passed a bill earlier this year to limit the government’s authority to access email.

Still, 11 Democrats and one independent senator who affiliates with them voted for the McCain and Burr proposal, while only six Republicans peeled away from their party to oppose the measure.

Earlier this year, FBI Director James Comey said that giving the government the ability to collect information about electronic communications — such as a person’s email account, how much time a person spends on various websites, and their Internet protocol address — without obtaining a court order was the bureau’s top priority.

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/powerpost/wp/2016/06/22/after-orlando-senate-bill-seeks-to-allow-fbi-web-searches-without-court-order/

That last part is scarier than shit.

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13 hours ago, InsideThePark said:

I think you know that you were minimizing the ramification of individuals being placed on the terror watch and no-fly list by saying that the audacity of someone being placed on a list doesn't mean anything. I'm not arguing that alone presumes guilt.  But keep in mind that the Orlando killer was placed on the watch list a couple times. Turns out he was rightfully suspected as a potential danger. Anyway, getting past that and putting terminology aside, you seem to be in favor of not having either list to begin with. Would you like to see the government do away with them altogether?

When the threshold to be put on the list is so low and the reasons to be put on it so intentionally obscured as to put the meaning of being on the list into question, I'm not really sure why so many put stock into its value. Clearly there are those whom have been proven to be a risk and are justified to endure their consequences. There are many on the list that haven't though. However it appears that certain US Senators believe it is incumbent on the individual to prove their innocence, not the government its need to act. Seems to be more and more the trend these days.

It feels that the Democrats in the Senate would not have approved any of the deals the other side would have produced yesterday, and vice versa of course all the time, so that they could have their glorified camp out at the capital. Political theater at its...um..mediocre. The left may decry the NRA but their chosen representatives sure seem to enjoy having this particular wedge issue like a 6 year old enjoys a comforting blanket at night.

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2 hours ago, nate said:

The problem is there is no due process.  They are skating around the 4th and 6th amendments.

it seems to be based in the same rationale used for asset seizure/forfeiture by local police.

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On 6/22/2016 at 11:57 PM, arch stanton said:

I'm talking about the speed in which information travels. Plenty fast enough not to leave someone hanging.

If all law enforcement agencies were interconnected and their data systems were compatible enough for information to be retrieved from them within a matter of minutes, I would agree with you. This is not the case.

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2 hours ago, Vegas Halo Fan said:

If all law enforcement agencies were interconnected and their data systems were compatible enough for information to be retrieved from them within a matter of minutes, I would agree with you. This is not the case.

So first you utilize that cyber speed to fix your databases then get back to me. 

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