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Angels Interest in Will Smith and Tony Watson

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This sort of took over the Hot Stove thread, but good to bring it up here. 

Both are perfect targets IMO, and fit Eppler’s mold. 

I loved the idea @Dochalo (?) posted about the Angels taking Melancon’s contract as a way to get Watson and/or Smith a bit cheaper. 

That aside, the Giants system is relatively poor, so the Angels might be able to pull off a trade offering 2-3, maybe 4 prospects for both, provided they were from our lower-ranks. A quantity over quality type deal. The Giants are likely holding out trying to get a Top 10 guy, but I doubt Billy bites, and that’s why it’s yet to happen. 

As ST nears, with plenty of relievers still on the market, SF might grow more flexible, especially if they’re trying to trim some dollars.

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47 minutes ago, The_Outrunner said:

I heard on MLB radio on Sirius this AM , that the Angels were offering Calhoun to the Giants for Smith and Watson

 

Whoa!  If so, would be interested in who Eppler has in mind for RF. Adell to start the year?

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29 minutes ago, The_Outrunner said:

I heard on MLB radio on Sirius this AM , that the Angels were offering Calhoun to the Giants for Smith and Watson

Calhoun makes a lot of sense for San Fran...their current outfield is....well, a bunch of guys I don't know. 
Chris Shaw, Steven Duggar, and Austin Slater starting, with Mac Williamson, Mike Gerber, and Drew Ferguson backing up. 

But no way does he bring in Watson and Smith on his own. Angels would have to be taking salary back (Melancon is the only one that really makes sense) and/or adding some prospects in to bring even one of those back, I'd imagine. They actually seem like a team that would value someone like Hermosillo highly in a trade as well, and Rengifo or Fletcher would have some appeal too given that they're relatively thin on upper-minor IF help. 

Should the Angels deal Calhoun, it'd be interesting to see how they address RF. Wouldn't make much since turning right around and spending $$$ on a stopgap RF, since Calhoun effectively served that role, unless they were eyeing someone with a specific skillset like Markakis' consistency and OBP, or an upside play like Avisail Garcia. Have to guess more likely would be an attempted repeat of a Nava/Gentry bargain platoon (Guyer/Maybin/Grossman/Szczur?) with Adell as the contingency

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Melancon is owed $28 million through 2020, Watson $3.5 million in 2019 ($2.5 million player option for 2020), and Smith likely around $3.5 million as well in 2019. 

That's $21 million added right there for 2019.   Trading Calhoun to the Giants would free up $10.5 million in 2019 ($1 million buyout for 2020).

At least it beats taking on $62 million of Longoria's contract.

Melancon was hurt for part of 2017 and 2018.   His WHIP was sub 1.00 and ERA sub 2.00 from 2013 through 2016, but fell off while in S.F.

As for replacing Calhoun, maybe they are thinking of platooning Hermosillo and a cheap signing in RF, until Adell is ready?   Hermosillo (small sample size) did have .333/.400/.611/1.011 in 18 September at bats for the Halos.  

That would be a solid bullpen upgrade in experience, granted Melancon hasn't been good since 2016.   Then sign Lowrie or Moose? 

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so this is me kinda being a devil's advocate, but the Angels might be the one to balk at giving up Calhoun for that and here's why.  

Obviously, it depends on what they think Kole is gonna do, but right now I think they think he'll rebound to the tune of a 2.0 to 2.5 WAR season with GG defense and spend a decent amount of time in the leadoff spot vs. RHers.  Herm showed a bit of promise vs. LHers so that's not a bad platoon.  

Huge fan of Adell, but he's not ready to make that jump right this second and it's way too presumptive to think he'll be ready by mid year.  

So you'd be creating a decent sized hole in the lineup.  

Ask yourself what you'd rather have.  

A platoon of Jarrett Parker and Mike Hermosillo in RF with Watson and Smith, Moustakas at 3b and Cozart at 2b

or 

Calhoun and Ottavio, with Cozart/Fletcher at 2b/3b

I lean toward the top one, but it's not a no brainer.  

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Posted (edited)
50 minutes ago, Angel Oracle said:

Melancon is owed $28 million through 2020, Watson $3.5 million in 2019 ($2.5 million player option for 2020), and Smith likely around $3.5 million as well in 2019. 

That's $21 million added right there for 2019.   Trading Calhoun to the Giants would free up $10.5 million in 2019 ($1 million buyout for 2020).

At least it beats taking on $62 million of Longoria's contract.

Melancon was hurt for part of 2017 and 2018.   His WHIP was sub 1.00 and ERA sub 2.00 from 2013 through 2016, but fell off while in S.F.

As for replacing Calhoun, maybe they are thinking of platooning Hermosillo and a cheap signing in RF, until Adell is ready?   Hermosillo (small sample size) did have .333/.400/.611/1.011 in 18 September at bats for the Halos.  

That would be a solid bullpen upgrade in experience, granted Melancon hasn't been good since 2016.   Then sign Lowrie or Moose? 

Current free agents that'd work well with Hermosillo include...

Robbie Grossman: 29, a switch-hitter, and 3-yr averaging .266/.371/.400/.771 with an OPS+ of 109 playing part-time RF/LF for Minnesota. Not great defense. Very good OBP.

Matt Szczur: also 29, right-handed hitter, career slash of .231/.312/.366/.666 with an OPS+ of 80, playing all three OF positions. Slightly better defense, not much bat, decent discipline.

Melky Cabrera: 34, switch-hitter, recently slashed .280/.335/.420/.755 with Cleveland, playing the corners. Pretty consistent and right at his career .286/.335/.418/.753 career mark.

Hard to not wonder what Markakis' career .358 OBP would look like in front of Trout though, or if Adam Jones could pull off a Tigers-era Torii Hunter revival with a move to RF. But I'd rather see that money go towards pitching on a solid infield bat, go with a cheap platoon option above, and let Adell step in midseason.
 

Edited by totdprods

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12 minutes ago, Dochalo said:

so this is me kinda being a devil's advocate, but the Angels might be the one to balk at giving up Calhoun for that and here's why.  

Obviously, it depends on what they think Kole is gonna do, but right now I think they think he'll rebound to the tune of a 2.0 to 2.5 WAR season with GG defense and spend a decent amount of time in the leadoff spot vs. RHers.  Herm showed a bit of promise vs. LHers so that's not a bad platoon.  

Huge fan of Adell, but he's not ready to make that jump right this second and it's way too presumptive to think he'll be ready by mid year.  

So you'd be creating a decent sized hole in the lineup.  

Ask yourself what you'd rather have.  

A platoon of Jarrett Parker and Mike Hermosillo in RF with Watson and Smith, Moustakas at 3b and Cozart at 2b

or 

Calhoun and Ottavio, with Cozart/Fletcher at 2b/3b

I lean toward the top one, but it's not a no brainer.  

Nick Castallenos would fit in nicely.

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No way the Giants give both Watson and Smith for Calhoun. Watson and Smith are both elite relievers; not Kimbrel/Chapman types, but still very good. Calhoun has been an average to good starting outfielder, but coming off a sub-par year. I am not convinced he's going to bounce back, as he was terrible for most of the year except for about a six week span in which he was JD Martinez. In other words, he absolutely sucked for about 75% of the year.

If the Angels can get both for Calhoun, it will be a coup. But my guess is that they'd have to throw in someone like Jose Suarez.

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9 minutes ago, Angelsjunky said:

No way the Giants give both Watson and Smith for Calhoun. Watson and Smith are both elite relievers; not Kimbrel/Chapman types, but still very good. Calhoun has been an average to good starting outfielder, but coming off a sub-par year. I am not convinced he's going to bounce back, as he was terrible for most of the year except for about a six week span in which he was JD Martinez. In other words, he absolutely sucked for about 75% of the year.

If the Angels can get both for Calhoun, it will be a coup. But my guess is that they'd have to throw in someone like Jose Suarez.

Errr....I agree in general with what you're saying, but wanted to say 75% is a little harsh. ~50% at most.

He opened the year with 50 awful games. .145/.195/.179/.374 awful. No good stretches.

He came back in June (after working with our new hitting coach), delivered in his first game back (2-4, 2B, HR), and didn't really cool down (.896 OPS) until 70 games later on Sept. 11th. He wrapped the last 17 games going .098/.191/.197/.388.
 

But even the Aug. 10-Sept. 10 stretch leading to that was still a totally reasonable Calhoun-esque .252/.358/.388/.746.

Hopefully the Sept. dive was just a result of losing some focus as games became meaningless, or growing rusty from the work he did with Reed. The results were so similar to the first stretch of awful, I'm hoping it was just some reverting to bad habits.
 

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2 hours ago, jordan said:

 

Whoa!  If so, would be interested in who Eppler has in mind for RF. Adell to start the year?

Angels going to sign Harper or Pollock to play RF then when Adell is ready move him to LF and have Upton play 1B. Cuz why the hell not at this point.

Just kidding, I hope they don't.....

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2 hours ago, totdprods said:

Calhoun makes a lot of sense for San Fran...their current outfield is....well, a bunch of guys I don't know. 
Chris Shaw, Steven Duggar, and Austin Slater starting, with Mac Williamson, Mike Gerber, and Drew Ferguson backing up. 

But no way does he bring in Watson and Smith on his own. Angels would have to be taking salary back (Melancon is the only one that really makes sense) and/or adding some prospects in to bring even one of those back, I'd imagine. They actually seem like a team that would value someone like Hermosillo highly in a trade as well, and Rengifo or Fletcher would have some appeal too given that they're relatively thin on upper-minor IF help. 

Should the Angels deal Calhoun, it'd be interesting to see how they address RF. Wouldn't make much since turning right around and spending $$$ on a stopgap RF, since Calhoun effectively served that role, unless they were eyeing someone with a specific skillset like Markakis' consistency and OBP, or an upside play like Avisail Garcia. Have to guess more likely would be an attempted repeat of a Nava/Gentry bargain platoon (Guyer/Maybin/Grossman/Szczur?) with Adell as the contingency

If we got back to a Nava/Gentry and Maybin platoon then I'll have a heart attack.  

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1 hour ago, Dochalo said:

so this is me kinda being a devil's advocate, but the Angels might be the one to balk at giving up Calhoun for that and here's why.  

Obviously, it depends on what they think Kole is gonna do, but right now I think they think he'll rebound to the tune of a 2.0 to 2.5 WAR season with GG defense and spend a decent amount of time in the leadoff spot vs. RHers.  Herm showed a bit of promise vs. LHers so that's not a bad platoon.  

Huge fan of Adell, but he's not ready to make that jump right this second and it's way too presumptive to think he'll be ready by mid year.  

So you'd be creating a decent sized hole in the lineup.  

Ask yourself what you'd rather have.  

A platoon of Jarrett Parker and Mike Hermosillo in RF with Watson and Smith, Moustakas at 3b and Cozart at 2b

or 

Calhoun and Ottavio, with Cozart/Fletcher at 2b/3b

I lean toward the top one, but it's not a no brainer.  

I lean towards the top one as well..... But we aren't going to sign Moustakas. 

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1 hour ago, Dochalo said:

so this is me kinda being a devil's advocate, but the Angels might be the one to balk at giving up Calhoun for that and here's why.  

Obviously, it depends on what they think Kole is gonna do, but right now I think they think he'll rebound to the tune of a 2.0 to 2.5 WAR season with GG defense and spend a decent amount of time in the leadoff spot vs. RHers.  Herm showed a bit of promise vs. LHers so that's not a bad platoon.  

Huge fan of Adell, but he's not ready to make that jump right this second and it's way too presumptive to think he'll be ready by mid year.  

So you'd be creating a decent sized hole in the lineup.  

Ask yourself what you'd rather have.  

A platoon of Jarrett Parker and Mike Hermosillo in RF with Watson and Smith, Moustakas at 3b and Cozart at 2b

or 

Calhoun and Ottavio, with Cozart/Fletcher at 2b/3b

I lean toward the top one, but it's not a no brainer.  

For whatever its worth, fangraphs projects him about 1.9.  

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Posted (edited)
24 minutes ago, angelsnationtalk said:

If we got back to a Nava/Gentry and Maybin platoon then I'll have a heart attack.  

I’d be okay with two of Hermosillo, Bourjos, Maybin, Grossman, Cabrera, Szczur (I’d prefer Maybin/Grossman, but that’s also the costliest) if it meant Adell was deemed midseason ready by Eppler and the money saved from Calhoun helped our pitching substantially.

Also, if it was a straight salary dump, I’d like to think Eppler might be able to find a good prospect or two for Calhoun, akin to the Cron-Rengifo deal.

Edited by totdprods

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