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Angels Interest in Will Smith and Tony Watson

105 posts in this topic

5 hours ago, The_Outrunner said:

I heard on MLB radio on Sirius this AM , that the Angels were offering Calhoun to the Giants for Smith and Watson

There would have to be a prospect or two thrown in here. Maybe something like Calhoun + jesus Castillo? I am half afraid we'd have to  give up something like Thaiss n a deal like this.

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If they moved Calhoun, I'd imagine they'd sign a stop-gap OF, or maybe move Fletcher to the OF, with his defensive versatility and his arm. Maybe both.

Or they really think Adell is nearly ready and plan on him being the guy.

Bourjos could start for us for a month, if they want to start him there. He could have a career resurgance.

This would be a great deal.

Expand it to include Bumgartner, it's even better. Even if we had to give up an arm like Suarez or Barria and Prospect Currency like Thaiss or Fletcher.

 

 

 

 

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31 minutes ago, Hubs said:

If they moved Calhoun, I'd imagine they'd sign a stop-gap OF, or maybe move Fletcher to the OF, with his defensive versatility and his arm. Maybe both.

Or they really think Adell is nearly ready and plan on him being the guy.

Bourjos could start for us for a month, if they want to start him there. He could have a career resurgance.

This would be a great deal.

Expand it to include Bumgartner, it's even better. Even if we had to give up an arm like Suarez or Barria and Prospect Currency like Thaiss or Fletcher.

 

 

 

 

If they moved Calhoun + B-C type prospects for Smith/Watson, they could sign Nick Markakis on a 1-year deal. 

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41 minutes ago, Hubs said:

If they moved Calhoun, I'd imagine they'd sign a stop-gap OF, or maybe move Fletcher to the OF, with his defensive versatility and his arm. Maybe both.

Or they really think Adell is nearly ready and plan on him being the guy.

Bourjos could start for us for a month, if they want to start him there. He could have a career resurgance.

This would be a great deal.

Expand it to include Bumgartner, it's even better. Even if we had to give up an arm like Suarez or Barria and Prospect Currency like Thaiss or Fletcher.

 

 

 

 

I assume the Giants would want more than Barria and Calhoun if Bummy is involved. I like the idea, though.

Smith, Watson, Bumgarner (maybe a low tier prospects) 

for

Calhoun, Barria, Castillo, and someone??

All SF players are in walk years so it's a risk for us and SF gets two young controllable pitchers plus a GG outfielder and another prospect...

What do you think?

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23 minutes ago, angelsnationtalk said:

I assume the Giants would want more than Barria and Calhoun if Bummy is involved. I like the idea, though.

Smith, Watson, Bumgarner (maybe a low tier prospects) 

for

Calhoun, Barria, Castillo, and someone??

All SF players are in walk years so it's a risk for us and SF gets two young controllable pitchers plus a GG outfielder and another prospect...

What do you think?

Maybe I am just burned from last year, but I'd almost rather keep most of the pitchers and add in Thaiss or Jam Jones - Especially since I don't think they would take such a mid-level package for MadBum -- even in his walk year.

image.png

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Again i wonder though, what is the point of 2 reliever who wont be here more than 1-2 years given our current status and the wait till 21 plan?  This move simply doesnt mesh with that plan in my opinion.

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3 minutes ago, floplag said:

Again i wonder though, what is the point of 2 reliever who wont be here more than 1-2 years given our current status and the wait till 21 plan?  This move simply doesnt mesh with that plan in my opinion.

Was wondering the same thing, but I think it's the possibility of getting them to new contracts before they hit free agency. Basically negotiation rights plus a better shot at winning WC this year. Could work according to plan...

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22 minutes ago, angelsnationtalk said:

I assume the Giants would want more than Barria and Calhoun if Bummy is involved. I like the idea, though.

Smith, Watson, Bumgarner (maybe a low tier prospects) 

for

Calhoun, Barria, Castillo, and someone??

All SF players are in walk years so it's a risk for us and SF gets two young controllable pitchers plus a GG outfielder and another prospect...

What do you think?

there's not a lot of reason to give up someone like Barria for 1yr of Madbum right now.  That feels more like something you do at the deadline if you're in it.  plus, Castillo isn't really a prospect anymore.  He's probably the next guy off the 40 man.  

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7 minutes ago, ScruffytheJanitor said:

Maybe I am just burned from last year, but I'd almost rather keep most of the pitchers and add in Thaiss or Jam Jones - Especially since I don't think they would take such a mid-level package for MadBum -- even in his walk year.

image.png

I'd add in Thaiss but I wouldn't want to trade Jones in something that involves only one year deals.... Jones has potential to be everyday second base.... Thaiss does too but i'd trade him before Jones. 

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2 minutes ago, Dochalo said:

there's not a lot of reason to give up someone like Barria for 1yr of Madbum right now.  That feels more like something you do at the deadline if you're in it.  plus, Castillo isn't really a prospect anymore.  He's probably the next guy off the 40 man.  

If you can be sure you'd sign him to a new contract after the year then I'd do it. That's a BIG IF though... 

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3 hours ago, totdprods said:

Errr....I agree in general with what you're saying, but wanted to say 75% is a little harsh. ~50% at most.

He opened the year with 50 awful games. .145/.195/.179/.374 awful. No good stretches.

He came back in June (after working with our new hitting coach), delivered in his first game back (2-4, 2B, HR), and didn't really cool down (.896 OPS) until 70 games later on Sept. 11th. He wrapped the last 17 games going .098/.191/.197/.388.
 

But even the Aug. 10-Sept. 10 stretch leading to that was still a totally reasonable Calhoun-esque .252/.358/.388/.746.

Hopefully the Sept. dive was just a result of losing some focus as games became meaningless, or growing rusty from the work he did with Reed. The results were so similar to the first stretch of awful, I'm hoping it was just some reverting to bad habits.
 

Alright, that makes me feel a bit better going forward. My memory was that he was only good for about six weeks, or about a third or less of the year. Looks like it was a solid 2 1/2 to 3 months, or about half the year.

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7 minutes ago, angelsnationtalk said:

Was wondering the same thing, but I think it's the possibility of getting them to new contracts before they hit free agency. Basically negotiation rights plus a better shot at winning WC this year. Could work according to plan...

Always a possibility of course i just dont see the logic of such a trade in a rebuild year, if thats truly what we are doing.  
It makes perfect sense in a go for it year, but presumably thats not where we are. 
This just screams that they are lurking in the weeds to me possibly trying to do something crazy, its the only way considering a deal like this makes any sense at all to me

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Imagine this pitching staff:

Rotation: Bumgarner, Heaney, Skaggs, Harvey, Cahill, with Tropeano/Pena as #6.

Bullpen: Smith, Watson, Buttrey, Anderson, Garcia, Bedrosian/Robles, Tropeano/Pena/Cole.

That's a pretty good pitching staff.

Parker/Hermosillo/Bourjos/Walsh should be able to muster 1-2 WAR, which isn't that much worse than Calhoun's 2-3 WAR.

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1 minute ago, floplag said:

Always a possibility of course i just dont see the logic of such a trade in a rebuild year, if thats truly what we are doing.  
It makes perfect sense in a go for it year, but presumably thats not where we are. 
This just screams that they are lurking in the weeds to me possibly trying to do something crazy, its the only way considering a deal like this makes any sense at all to me

I do think our "real shot" starts 2020... But I agree. 

Well the Angels have been known to do some crazy so nothing surprises me anymore...

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4 minutes ago, Angelsjunky said:

Imagine this pitching staff:

Rotation: Bumgarner, Heaney, Skaggs, Harvey, Cahill, with Tropeano/Pena as #6.

Bullpen: Smith, Watson, Buttrey, Anderson, Garcia, Bedrosian/Robles, Tropeano/Pena/Cole.

That's a pretty good pitching staff.

Parker/Hermosillo/Bourjos/Walsh should be able to muster 1-2 WAR, which isn't that much worse than Calhoun's 2-3 WAR.

Then if Bumgarner is sign to a new contract the depth for 2020 looks like this:

Bumgarner, Ohtani, Heaney, Skaggs, Barria, Canning, Suarez, Sandoval.... I like that

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Posted (edited)
23 minutes ago, Angelsjunky said:

Imagine this pitching staff:

Rotation: Bumgarner, Heaney, Skaggs, Harvey, Cahill, with Tropeano/Pena as #6.

Bullpen: Smith, Watson, Buttrey, Anderson, Garcia, Bedrosian/Robles, Tropeano/Pena/Cole.

That's a pretty good pitching staff.

Parker/Hermosillo/Bourjos/Walsh should be able to muster 1-2 WAR, which isn't that much worse than Calhoun's 2-3 WAR.

I like it a lot. I don’t think the difference between bargain scrapings for RF and Calhoun would cost us too many wins with a pitching staff that much improved. If we don’t make the playoffs, it’s not because we didn’t have Kole, IMO.

And I can see this making some sense. The Angels *should* be in the mix for Bumgarner - he checks a lot of the boxes Eppler pursues in a trade, but understandably he won’t trade top assets for a rental, which might be loosened with elite relievers being added in to the mix. 

Calhoun, one of Barria/Suarez, and one of Fletcher or Rengifo probably gets you close to landing the trio. Calhoun and Bumgarner’s money cancel each other, so Kole is really not the value in the deal, just balancing the money. It’s a haul, but relatively fair.

I’d imagine another piece would be necessary for the Angels and that could be a sticking point. Perhaps the Giants want someone like Justin Anderson or Buttrey to immediately step into the pen and give them good, cheap, controllable relief help, and the Angels are preferring to part with low-level guys like Deveaux, Yan, Rodriguez, Swanda.

I can’t see SF’s new GM move a legend like Bumgarner without getting one Top 100 prospect back, especially with two very good relievers thrown in, so you may need to go a different route, offer them Kole, Bedrosian, and at least one of Jones or Marsh as another option as well. 

Edited by totdprods

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51 minutes ago, floplag said:

Again i wonder though, what is the point of 2 reliever who wont be here more than 1-2 years given our current status and the wait till 21 plan?  This move simply doesnt mesh with that plan in my opinion.

They help you win now, if you aren’t winning now but they are performing you’ll receive more at the deadline for them than you’ll give up to get them.   Also the team hasn’t given up on trying to win.  

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8 minutes ago, Stradling said:

They help you win now, if you aren’t winning now but they are performing you’ll receive more at the deadline for them than you’ll give up to get them.   Also the team hasn’t given up on trying to win.  

Perfectly said. It's a risk worth taking for the Angels. 

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