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OC Register: Jake Marisnick suspended 2 games following collision with Angels’ Jonathan Lucroy

68 posts in this topic

10 hours ago, Inside Pitch said:

Played through college and never once had a play that was close enough for it to even cross my mind... Which is sort of why I believe he just freaked and reacted.   

translation: IP was so fast, he always outran the throw.

always.

edge: Lowell

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1 hour ago, Ace-Of-Diamonds said:

he altered his path to the plate which caused the collision. regardless of intent; a violation of the rule... It looked intentional to me, he couldn't have touched plate even if there would not have been a collision from the path he chose. he meant to make sure Lucroy didn't catch that ball.

You are having a different conversation. 

The rule you are talking about only relates to whether he’s safe or out. He broke the rule. He was called out.

No one disputes that. 

The question is whether it was intentional/malicious or just a misjudgment/accident.

That is the question that determines whether there should be discipline and how severe it should be. 

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4 hours ago, Lou said:

This has absolutely nothing to do with the conversation. 

The pitch in the dirt comparison is to illustrate that you react to what you think is going to happen, and sometimes you’re wrong. 

In the video I posted before, it shows Lucroy shuffling his feet and shifting his weight and moving his glove all toward the 3B line. Marisnick said he saw that and decided to go the other way. 

Anyway, some of you believe it and some of you don’t. I happen to believe him, based on my discussion with other players, the interview with him, his reaction after it happened and that video I mentioned. 

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15 minutes ago, Jeff Fletcher said:

You are having a different conversation. 

The rule you are talking about only relates to whether he’s safe or out. He broke the rule. He was called out.

No one disputes that. 

The question is whether it was intentional/malicious or just a misjudgment/accident.

That is the question that determines whether there should be discipline and how severe it should be. 

disagree.  the question is whether he made an attempt to avoid contact.  That is what the players have been asked to do.  Avoid contact with the catcher on close plays.  It's not about malice or intent.  

If we concede that it was an 'accident' and that he chose the wrong path then fine.  He made a split second choice to lower his should and put his body into a position to win the interaction.  to score the run.  As opposed to avoiding contact.  Again, if you've got time enough to react where you position yourself for impact by lowering your shoulder then you've got enough time not to do that.  He could have just as readily rolled over even more inside the line.  Maybe he makes partial contact and he and lucory sort of bounce off each other.  The ball skips away and he gets up and touches the plate while Lucory goes and gets the ball.  

There was an opportunity to minimize the extent of contact because there was an opportunity to maximize it.  He took the latter.  The nature of the collision tells you that.  A collision where he's surprised by the route of the catcher doesn't result in what it did.  

All the parties involved were interviewed and a suspension was levied.  That should tell you something.  

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9 minutes ago, Jeff Fletcher said:

The pitch in the dirt comparison is to illustrate that you react to what you think is going to happen, and sometimes you’re wrong. 

In the video I posted before, it shows Lucroy shuffling his feet and shifting his weight and moving his glove all toward the 3B line. Marisnick said he saw that and decided to go the other way. 

Anyway, some of you believe it and some of you don’t. I happen to believe him, based on my discussion with other players, the interview with him, his reaction after it happened and that video I mentioned. 

then why the suspension?  Why didn't he keep going further inside to avoid contact even if it meant he had no chance at touch the plate?  His thought process was to score the run and I get it.   There was a split second where he could have avoided jamming his helmet into Lucroy's face.  Maybe they still make contact but it doesn't end up as an open field tackle.  

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30 minutes ago, Dochalo said:

then why the suspension?  Why didn't he keep going further inside to avoid contact even if it meant he had no chance at touch the plate?  His thought process was to score the run and I get it.   There was a split second where he could have avoided jamming his helmet into Lucroy's face.  Maybe they still make contact but it doesn't end up as an open field tackle.  

Because Lucroy was blocking the entire line to the plate. It was JL’s fault. Don’t you read the Astros boards? Get with the program. 

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5 hours ago, Sean-Regan said:

Because Lucroy was blocking the entire line to the plate. It was JL’s fault. Don’t you read the Astros boards? Get with the program. 

Good Lord, how Angels fans love to wallow in their self-pity and victimhood. 

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8 hours ago, Jeff Fletcher said:

The pitch in the dirt comparison is to illustrate that you react to what you think is going to happen, and sometimes you’re wrong. 

In the video I posted before, it shows Lucroy shuffling his feet and shifting his weight and moving his glove all toward the 3B line. Marisnick said he saw that and decided to go the other way. 

Anyway, some of you believe it and some of you don’t. I happen to believe him, based on my discussion with other players, the interview with him, his reaction after it happened and that video I mentioned. 

Oh for crying out loud he was positioning to recieve the ball and his glove was going up the third base line, not towards the foul line. If Marisnick decided to "go the other way" then why does he cut back inside and hit Lucroy on his left side? Marisnick was tracking every move Lucroy made to insure he could jar the ball loose, not one setep in the last 10 says he is trying to find an open lane. 

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8 hours ago, Dochalo said:

disagree.  the question is whether he made an attempt to avoid contact.  That is what the players have been asked to do.  Avoid contact with the catcher on close plays.  It's not about malice or intent.  

If we concede that it was an 'accident' and that he chose the wrong path then fine.  He made a split second choice to lower his should and put his body into a position to win the interaction.  to score the run.  As opposed to avoiding contact.  Again, if you've got time enough to react where you position yourself for impact by lowering your shoulder then you've got enough time not to do that.  He could have just as readily rolled over even more inside the line.  Maybe he makes partial contact and he and lucory sort of bounce off each other.  The ball skips away and he gets up and touches the plate while Lucory goes and gets the ball.  

There was an opportunity to minimize the extent of contact because there was an opportunity to maximize it.  He took the latter.  The nature of the collision tells you that.  A collision where he's surprised by the route of the catcher doesn't result in what it did.  

All the parties involved were interviewed and a suspension was levied.  That should tell you something.  

First of all, I don’t think anyone was interviewed. I think they looked at the video. 

Second, you’re still talking about why he was called out. 

He was called out for leaving his path and making contact. No one disputes he was properly called out  

He was suspended for 2 games because it was negligent and Lucroy got hurt. 

If MLB believed it was intentional or malicious, he’d have gotten a lot more than 2 games. Don’t you think?

Basically, all I’m saying is that I don’t believe he changed his path with the intent to hit Lucroy. I believe he changed his path in a misguided attempt to miss Lucroy. He was still wrong, and he can be still be held somewhat responsible, but it was more poor judgment than malice.

I am just repeating myself over and over for different people now, so I’m out  

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16 minutes ago, Blarg said:

Oh for crying out loud he was positioning to recieve the ball and his glove was going up the third base line, not towards the foul line. If Marisnick decided to "go the other way" then why does he cut back inside and hit Lucroy on his left side? Marisnick was tracking every move Lucroy made to insure he could jar the ball loose, not one setep in the last 10 says he is trying to find an open lane. 

He took one step inside fair territory before the collision. 

And what’s the difference between “the 3B line” and “the foul line” to you?

He sees Lucroy’s feet and glove and believes he’s moving toward the 3B dugout. Also, his glove is on his right hand, so one way to make yourself harder to tag is to go around the catcher’s left side (toward the 1B dugout).

Marisnick took exactly one stride to his right (toward 1B) but Lucroy didn’t continue moving toward 3B as he’d expected, so they collided.

 

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1 hour ago, Blarg said:

Okay, Jeff. Just don't drive like Marisnick because you are going to hit everyone in the left hand turn lane because you saw the car move. 

Fair point. 

One time I was sitting at a red light at the intersection and the car next to me moved a little forward so I started to go. But he stopped and then I realized the light hadn’t changed so I had to stop. 

The point is I was definitely negligent because I wasn’t looking at the light. But I was not “intending” to go into the intersection when the light was red. Just careless. 

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